July-September 2015 Quarterly Review: Admintendo Eleven GO Skypers 2015 Xtreme

ZeroJones: Ready?

JayMoyles: Ready.

ZeroJones: [three, two, one... points finger at actors]

ZeroJones: Good day to you, dear reader! It's time for another Admintendo. Tonight I, Zero of the clan Jones, will be playing the role of your humble host. Sitting at the other end of the Internet connection is...

JayMoyles: *removes Balladeer mask* IT'S ME ZERO. IT WAS ME ALL ALONG. And by me, it's JayMoyles. Hello, and thanks for having me on.

ZeroJones: Nyargh! You'd have gotten away with it too, if it wasn't for these meddling kids?

JayMoyles: It came down to me and a cardboard cutout of Patrick Kielty for this Admintendo - luckily, I made it in!

ZeroJones: It was a close vote, let me tell you! In all seriousness, we're very glad to have you here whilst Balla is located in STUDYING, poor sod.

JayMoyles: And I'm glad to be here! Best of luck to Balla with his studies - having just wrapped up four years of uni, the thought of further study sends chills down my spine.

So instead, I get to chat about games! Wahaha!

ZeroJones: Yes, lots of luck to Balla! Anyway, let's begin that chat right now! What are your personal highlights from the forum over its last quarter?

JayMoyles: I think my biggest highlight has been the Counting Classics thread. It's been fun reliving Nintendo's greatest hits and having a bit of a friendly debate about what constitutes as a classic game. And of course, getting a bit salty when your personal favourite doesn't make it into the list. I'm looking forward to Mas's continuation of the thread - especially once it starts getting into more recent years, as my knowledge of games before the NES era is shaky to say the least!

Besides that, I've been enjoying sharing my Metal Gear Solid experiences over on Nontendo, and I think the folks reading that thread have been enjoying reliving MGS vicariously through me, so that's a plus!

What about you, Sir Zero?

ZeroJones: Can only agree with you on the Classics thread - Balla's put some sterling work into that and I feel like we've all made great contributions to it. Mas's switch to a time-based rather than console-based set-up should breathe new life into it, too - great timing.

JayMoyles: Absolutely - and it avoids the issue of having multiplatform games pop up multiple times.

ZeroJones: Very much so! Things were getting heated for a while on that very issue.

Since Admintendo X, we've had the utterly tragic passing of Satoru Iwata. All the threads in which respect was paid to him were touching and real. From my personal perspective, it's always fun to carry out a vote thread and see the top ten take shape.

JayMoyles: I neglected to mention Iwata as his passing was anything but a highlight, but you're right in saying the tribute shown to him was fantastic from us all. It was a genuine and heartbreaking shock, and I think we all helped each other remember him by sharing our best Iwata memories.

ZeroJones: The whole Internet, near enough, came together for Mr. Iwata's passing in a positive way and it was beautiful, in a way.

JayMoyles: Absolutely. My Twitter feed was full of people sharing Iwata interviews or talking about the effect of him and his games on their lives. Here's to you, Mr. Iwata.

ZeroJones: *raises glass*

JayMoyles: Shall we move onto some games?

ZeroJones: We shall! Mr. Iwata was a gamer first, and so are we... you mentioned that you've been playing some Metal Gearage, Sir Jay?

JayMoyles: Indeed! I shan't bore you with the intricate details - no podcast repeats here! - but I will say that I've totally fallen in love with the series. Kojima is bonkers in the best possible way, and the series has surprised me with its emotional depth. I hadn't really expected anything beyond a stealth-em-up with some military mumbo jumbo thrown in, but it's much more than that. MGS3 in particular blew me away, and the ending made me tear up a little! Did you get a chance to check out MGS3 when it came to 3DS, Zero?

ZeroJones: I didn't, I'm afraid, though the aforehinted-at podcast gents suggested I should get hold of it. I'm generally not a fan of stealth, to be honest, although so many people have said how ace the story is... and I've not properly played on my 3DS for a month.

JayMoyles: I wasn't really a fan of stealth either (I'm responsible for the Wind Waker stealth segment not existing in the year 3000, after all) before my Metal Gear journey began, but I've grew to enjoy it. And unlike the other games in the series, MGS3 is easily played as a standalone title. Its story doesn't really need any background knowledge to understand. So yeah, it's recommended!

Besides that, I've spent the past week obsessing over a little game called Undertale. It's the closest thing to a Mother game that I've played which hasn't come from Itoi himself. I've noticed a bit of a trend in indie RPGs lately where they purposefully try to emulate the Mother series with varying success (am I right in saying you've played Citizens of Earth? I heard that wasn't fantastic) but Undertale feels almost exactly like a Mother game, besides its unique combat system. It shares the Mother sense of humour, its memorable soundtrack, its aesthetic and most importantly, its emotional heart. I really can't recommend it enough. I hope it reaches other platforms besides PC/Mac so folks have a chance to play it.

I've got a review half-written that'll be going up on Gintendo this weekend (*cough*cheapplug*cough*), so I'll get into it more detail there.

ZeroJones: I read your write-up of it for the Last Game You Finished thread and it sounds right up my street (and Citizens Of Earth promised much but delivered little).

JayMoyles: Yeah, I think you'd really enjoy it Zero. I'd go as far to say that it's a must-play for anyone who enjoyed Earthbound.

ZeroJones: I look forward to your review!

JayMoyles: But I'll stop writing essays about what I've been playing now! What's been on your various gameboxes recently?

ZeroJones: In between Code Name S.T.E.A.M., YWW and Super Mario Maker, the eShop has propped up my gaming time with Picross e97235, Bike Rider DX2 (not as good as the original), Year Walk (really quite unsettling), Runbow (bloody brilliant) and my current Wii U squeeze, the Plague Of Shadows DLC for Shovel Knight! Have you had a chance to partake in that, Jay Knight?

JayMoyles: Indeed I have, Zero Knight. I've not played much of yet - only a few stages - but I'm surprised at how different the game feels playing as Plague Knight. How are you getting on with it?

ZeroJones: I'm a couple of stages before the end and I have loved it from the moment I worked out how Plague Knight's boost jump works. You're totally right: it almost completely changes how you play the game in a level, and the way the story has been remade has impressed me, too. Great stuff and makes the whole Shovel Knight package even easier to recommend!

To be honest, though, the very best time I'm having on a game at the moment is playing Final Fantasy V on my phone.

JayMoyles: Ah! That's one of the few Final Fantasy games I've not had the chance to play. How's it holding up?

ZeroJones: It feels like all the others I've played - strictly a 6-and-below guy until very recently, when 7 came out on iOS - and it's just the kind of old-school RPG I love. It's making me hanker for 3DS Dragon Quests VII and VIII to get a release date in the West!

JayMoyles: Perhaps I'll check out FFV then. Although considering my gargantuan backlog, I've no idea when that'd be!

ZeroJones: I know what you mean - I've got over 60 games lying around, crying at me to finish them! And then Nintendo go and release Super Mario Maker: a brilliant game which you can spend hours on and not really finish!

JayMoyles: I've been enjoying watching videos of the crazy levels folks have made - it looks like a blast! What sort of levels have you been making?

ZeroJones: I've really stalled recently, as my creative muse has deserted me! I have a couple out there: my first one just had a load of Paragoombas to jump on, and my second one was a level with a really low ceiling and a few obstacles to negotiate. That one unlocked a few more toys and now I'm stuck with what to do with them! There's a half-finished pseudo-shmup level in storage that I really should dust down, but the options for levels are incredible. It makes me wonder about the future of 2D Mario games...

JayMoyles: It does seem like they've shot themselves in the foot in regards to future 2D Mario games, considering they've basically perfected the 2D Mario game here. That's a credit to Mario Maker - the variety of levels you can make is staggering!

ZeroJones: It is - I understand that the global total of SMM levels was 2.2 million a day or two ago, which is more than enough by far. Never mind the Mario series - where does the 2D platformer genre go from here?!

JayMoyles: Woah, that's great! Glad to see it's selling well. And, well, obviously Mega Sonic Crafter is next.

ZeroJones: SMM already has the sideways springs and ability to play as Sonic, mind you...

JayMoyles: Welp, that's SEGA doomed.

Sorry Mas.

ZeroJones: It'd make a nice change from Nintendo being doomed, to be fair... speaking of which, the company is obviously in a bit of a transition phase at the moment. What direction do you see them taking in the next couple of years?

JayMoyles: Ah, the big question of Nintendo's future. It's a tough one - there seems to be a bit of a gloomy atmosphere around the Wii U just now (the purchase of my PS4 seemed to prompt a bit of chat about that) and it might be valid. The Christmas line-up is a bit sparse now that Star Fox has barrel-rolled his way into next year. But I think 2016 will be good for the Wii U - a year with Star Fox and Zelda (fingers crossed) in it? That's a stellar year.

But in terms of beyond that, Ninty does seem to be gearing up for the NX, whatever it may be. So it's a tough little limbo period for the Big N right now. And of course, there is the concerning spectre of *MOBILE GAMING* there...

How do you reckon Ninty are going to do over the next couple of years, Zero?

ZeroJones: It's pretty clear to me that they're going through the motions - with both their consoles - until the NX appears. I feel a bit sad about that, because there's still potential in both, and there is always the usual franchises that have not had an update for ages that they could revive, purely to generate buzz.

JayMoyles: *thinks wistfully on a potential new F-Zero or a proper Metroid* ...sigh.

ZeroJones: Having said that, your point about a Star Fox and a Zelda coming next year for the Wii U is a good one, and there must be more in the works. At any rate, NX to hit in early 2017, with a good chunk of revenue coming from whatever the mobile games are in the meantime. I would so very much like to hear more about them... but Nintendo always keep their cards close to their chest - cards they've probably made themselves, to be fair. And, yes, let someone, somewhere, be working on a console Metroid game, be it 2D or 3D!

JayMoyles: I think we're all needing more information about NX - everything's still a bit up in the air! We don't even know if it's a handheld, a home console, a hybrid, a series of AI dedicated to controlling the world's armies... give me info, please!

ZeroJones: Yeah, it's definitely time for Nintendo to play that card... it's all the fault of Christmas, I reckon. Grrr!

JayMoyles: You did this, Santa Claus!

ZeroJones: CLAUUUUUUUUUUUS!

JayMoyles: *insert .gif of Captain Kirk screaming*

ZeroJones: Ultimately, though, they should be alright, I'd say? NX needs to be successful, though.

JayMoyles: Yeah, Nintendo will be fine. They're still shifting software, the 3DS is still doing pretty well, and mobile will plug any gaps. If all else fails, they can just release another Pokemon game for that free Pokemon money.

ZeroJones: Pokémon Z in 2016! You heard it here first... unless you saw that hoax on Twitter.

JayMoyles: ADMINTENDO BREAKING NEWS, BROUGHT TO YOU BY ZERO AND JAY!

Also breaking news, the NX probably isn't a network of AI.

Just to clarify.

ZeroJones: Calm down, Arnold Schwarzenegger...

JayMoyles: I think it might be coming up to time for me to say hasta la vista!

ZeroJones: Indeed! It's just about time to wind this train into the station and shut up shop. It has been an absolute pleasure chatting with you, Sir Jay Knight!

JayMoyles: And to you, Sir Zero of the House Jones! Always fun chatting on Admintendo. I'm one appearance away from getting my own admin badge - that's how it works, right? :p

ZeroJones: I'll get back to you on that! In the meantime, it's goodbye from him...

JayMoyles: And it's a goodbye from him too! Ciao!

ZeroJones: Goodnight, everybody!

[recording light fades out]

---

Outtakes

ZeroJones: whispers Jay?

JayMoyles: *ZERO*

...curses, that was meant to be in bold text.

Hello!

...hello?

ZeroJones: Hello!

I did the asterisks for  ‘whispers’, so, who knows what's going on?!

JayMoyles: *test*

Hmm. Odd!

ZeroJones: Rubbish, is what I call it!

JayMoyles: * test2 *

Oh well! Rubbish indeed.

ZeroJones: Your Skype is busted, mate. It'll take us a week to get the part we need to fix it.

JayMoyles: Admintendo is doomed, I had about five witty asides that all revolved around bold text.

Good read like always, Chaps

SEGA is all about Persona 5 now anyway

I just enter [b ]this[/b] into Skype and let the forum software do it for me...

Cracking read, chaps! Really was a good one - bounded along at a good old rate, filled with gags and Nintendopinions.  Also, sobbing grateful thanks from me for not overdoing more MGSV talk - it's become one of those games that's so great that everyone's talking about it all of the time, leaving a Ninty-only gamer a bit worse for wear.  Glad you both enjoyed/are enjoying the Classics thread also.


Other random comments:

FFV felt like a cheap clone of the other better SNES FFs, Zero - still don't know what you see in the thing.  A lack of other big games to play, mayhaps?

I think that Zero Knight would have a giant hole in the middle of his body, that sucks the hero in and beats him up before spitting him out.

I'd personally be happy if the 2D Mario games had a good long rest after SMM, but they're such money spinners that that will never happen.  Nintendo at least need to think about what other directions they can take the series in, maybe risk a SMB2 or two, although sadly I can see Nintendo avoiding risks in the current climate.

Massive amounts of Wii U gloom right now, much of it deserved. It's had about two really big games each year (Pikmin 3/SM3DW, MK8/SSBU/Bayo 2, Splatoon/XCX, SF0/Zelda U), and it's fair enough to say that's not really satisfactory (although MK8, SSBU, and Splat have continued to deliver long after their releases).  On the other hand, I do feel things have been exaggerated somewhat, as my list of 20 possible Wii U classics shows.  

I'm more terrified about Nintendo going into mobile gaming than I am the Wii U's failure, mind.  If this takes off, it's more likely that Ninty will shift focus from "big games" to more F2P experiences, and more likely they'll drop dedicated handhelds.  Not really a future I want to live in.


All in all, 9/10 would read again (and probably will).

Balladeer wrote:

I'd personally be happy if the 2D Mario games had a good long rest after SMM, but they're such money spinners that that will never happen.  Nintendo at least need to think about what other directions they can take the series in, maybe risk a SMB2 or two, although sadly I can see Nintendo avoiding risks in the current climate.

If I were to throw out some wild speculation, I reckon there's a big 3D Mario on its way. Maybe an NX launch title? Who knows?!

That would be really great. Proper 3D Mario, though, not 2D Mario in 3D clothing SM3DL/W-style.

Balladeer wrote:

I just enter this into Skype and let the forum software do it for me...

...

FFV felt like a cheap clone of the other better SNES FFs, Zero - still don't know what you see in the thing.  A lack of other big games to play, mayhaps?

I think that Zero Knight would have a giant hole in the middle of his body, that sucks the hero in and beats him up before spitting him out.

I'd personally be happy if the 2D Mario games had a good long rest after SMM, but they're such money spinners that that will never happen.  Nintendo at least need to think about what other directions they can take the series in, maybe risk a SMB2 or two, although sadly I can see Nintendo avoiding risks in the current climate.

Massive amounts of Wii U gloom right now, much of it deserved. It's had about two really big games each year (Pikmin 3/SM3DW, MK8/SSBU/Bayo 2, Splatoon/XCX, SF0/Zelda U), and it's fair enough to say that's not really satisfactory (although MK8, SSBU, and Splat have continued to deliver long after their releases).  On the other hand, I do feel things have been exaggerated somewhat, as my list of 20 possible Wii U classics shows.  

...

All in all, 9/10 would read again (and probably will).

1) Surrounding text in asterisks should make it go bold on Skype... except it never worked for Jay, for some reason. That was also the only real outtake - we were totes profesh.

2) FFV has a relatively straightforward plot, I can dip in and out of it when I want because it's on my phone, and I am really enjoying setting up teams to take on battles. My focus at the moment is on hitting people. It may not have the grandiose sweep of the FF's immediately surrounding it but that is not a flaw, for me.

3) Brrr.

4) The more I think about it, the more I realise future 2D Mario titles need not fear SMM. As beautiful as some of the levels that have been created are, finding the Nintendo design touch over enough levels to fill a game will take a very long time indeed (at the moment, anyway).

5) The Wii U's issues are two-fold, for me. The first fold is that none of Nintendo's own games have blown me away as thoroughly as they did on the Wii. The second fold is that there is pretty much nothing else at retail worth speaking of, so the Nintendo-only gamer's plate is filled with tiny morsels of eShop goodies instead. That's not a bad thing, as such, just not a direction I expected to have to go in.

6) Cheers!

Balla wrote:

I think that Zero Knight would have a giant hole in the middle of his body, that sucks the hero in and beats him up before spitting him out.

Isn't that kirby?

---

Good read chaps though I did glaze over the rpg/final fantasy chat & this reminds that I still need to buy Year walk as well as get back to Shovel Knight: PoS.

Can't believe you're not all over Plague of Shadows like a rash, Jas!

The_Jaster wrote:

Good read chaps though I did glaze over the rpg/final fantasy chat...

Now you know how I feel about all non-Nintendo talk, all of the time.

I've got to get Year Walk too, as well as playing Undertale, when my exams are tidied up.  Exciting times!  Not sure I'll bother with PoS (which is an, er, unfortunate abbreviation): after saying I'd get back to Shovel Knight umpteen times, it's not really exercising any "pull" over me.  It's always, "Meh, I should play SK at some point, I suppose... just not now."  (is brutalised by Jas)

ZeroJones wrote:

2) FFV has a relatively straightforward plot, I can dip in and out of it when I want because it's on my phone, and I am really enjoying setting up teams to take on battles. My focus at the moment is on hitting people. It may not have the grandiose sweep of the FF's immediately surrounding it but that is not a flaw, for me.

...

4) The more I think about it, the more I realise future 2D Mario titles need not fear SMM. As beautiful as some of the levels that have been created are, finding the Nintendo design touch over enough levels to fill a game will take a very long time indeed (at the moment, anyway).

5) The Wii U's issues are two-fold, for me. The first fold is that none of Nintendo's own games have blown me away as thoroughly as they did on the Wii. The second fold is that there is pretty much nothing else at retail worth speaking of, so the Nintendo-only gamer's plate is filled with tiny morsels of eShop goodies instead. That's not a bad thing, as such, just not a direction I expected to have to go in.

1) I do like grandiose settings, it's true.  Nothing wrong with a straightforward plot, but the other two FFs had straightforward plots too (both of them driving the "evil empire" trope into the ground, with one then introducing an even eviller clown), and told them better.  I also feel that there are many RPGs with better battle systems to enjoy hitting people in.  (Fun Fact: I don't think FFVI is one of them. Too much of it revolved around "learn Ultima, spam Ultima".)

9) Whether or not 2D Marios need to fear SMM (and the necessarily limiting toolbox and creativity of Nintendo's own limit that, yes), I feel the series could do with a rest.  When was the last time a 2D Mario made anyone go "ooooh, that's fresh and exciting"?  For me, it was probably Super Mario Land 2.

π) I think some of that's probably your personal taste, Zero - and mine too, to be fair.  While SM3DW is pretty much generally considered to be worse than SMG, I didn't care for Pikmin 3 or Bayonetta's genres, and I know you didn't like MK8, SSBU, or Splatoon for their multiplayer focus.  There are definitely fewer epic single-player experiences though, that's for sure.

Who doesn't like a good RPG, everything is better with RPG elements and some of Jas fav games are RPG's, If Nintendo brought out some good games more then once every 6 months then we could talk Nintendo. I feel we need a direct like in November going this is what happening next year with the Wii U & 3DS.

On NLife they've got a poll the Top 3 wanted Wii U games of this Holiday season is Xenoblade, FAST Racing Neo & Project Zero which could be 3 great games but if you don't like JRPG's eg Cappa then Xenoblade is not for you, FAST no matter how good it is will always been known as the game we got instead of F-Zero then Project Zero has a weird release & is a survival horror which again is not a universal loved genre like a platformer.

ZeroJones wrote:

Can't believe you're not all over Plague of Shadows like a rash, Jas!

I know! I've done King Knight, Spectre & the explodatorium levels then PES 2016 and the Rainbow 6 beta came along which have been taking all my attention.

Balla wrote:

I've got to get Year Walk too, as well as playing Undertale, when my exams are tidied up.  Exciting times!  Not sure I'll bother with PoS (which is an, er, unfortunate abbreviation): after saying I'd get back to Shovel Knight umpteen times, it's not really exercising any "pull" over me.  It's always, "Meh, I should play SK at some point, I suppose... just not now."  (is brutalised by Jas)

PoS is free so you'll have it anyway whenever you decide to turn the game on next, also I could just ask Zero to give you a slap since he loves SK as well.

Mas wrote:

Who doesn't like a good RPG, everything is better with RPG elements and some of Jas fav games are RPG's

That's because those are the right kind of RPG's.

Zero can't slap me! I have certain... "information" about him.

He also has certain "information" about me. Balances of power an' that.

The_Jaster wrote:

Mas wrote:

Who doesn't like a good RPG, everything is better with RPG elements and some of Jas fav games are RPG's

That's because those are the right kind of RPG's.

Is it traditional turn-based RPGs you don't like, Jas?

Balladeer wrote:

Zero can't slap me!  I have certain... "information" about him.

He also has certain "information" about me.  Balances of power an' that.

The less said about that, the better...

Suffice to say that neither of us has done anything as bad as David Cameron, dead pig or no dead pig.

JayMoyles wrote:

The_Jaster wrote:

Mas wrote:

Who doesn't like a good RPG, everything is better with RPG elements and some of Jas fav games are RPG's

That's because those are the right kind of RPG's.

Is it traditional turn-based RPGs you don't like, Jas?

Aye, I just don't like that I'm not in direct control of my character/team and typically can't defend incoming attacks so it ends up feeling like luck rather than skill, however, something like Paper Mario get's the turn-based system right since you have to time button presses to get more damage on attacks or to defend/counter.

The biggest thing though is the battles themselves just don't feel satisfying to me as I'm left watching them play out rather than executing the moves myself, I'd definitely try more if they were more involving like the battle system in Xenoblade.

You'd like Undertale then...

*cough*buyundertale*cough*

Turny-RPGs definitely aren't as "skill-based". The enjoyment comes out of the story, the characters, the environments, exploring the dungeons, and (in my case) the numbers being numberish.

The_Jaster wrote:

Aye, I just don't like that I'm not in direct control of my character/team and typically can't defend incoming attacks so it ends up feeling like luck rather than skill, however, something like Paper Mario get's the turn-based system right since you have to time button presses to get more damage on attacks or to defend/counter.

The biggest thing though is the battles themselves just don't feel satisfying to me as I'm left watching them play out rather than executing the moves myself, I'd definitely try more if they were more involving like the battle system in Xenoblade.

Paper Mario is brilliant in this regard and I wish more games would adopt the system (just Costume Quest 2 in my experience so far!). For me, though, the skill is in making sure that no random attack can take a member of your team out (or you've got a back-up plan if they do). In many ways, I like not being a part of the action in the traditional way: it gives me time to think about what's going to happen next!

* to indicate how old I feel sometimes*

Not many JRPG's use the old battle system now part from Pokemon, FFXV has a real-time one for instance.

JayMoyles wrote:

You'd like Undertale then...

*cough*buyundertale*cough*

The way it was described on the Bit socket podcast I listened to today it did sound pretty good, it's just PC & Mac isn't it? If so throw it on the pile of games that I want to play but don't have the right device to play it on.